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ColinL
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Re: BBC

Postby ColinL » Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:35 pm

cbe merely because you think something is 'obviously a cultural thing', does not make it true despite you getting annoyed that others will not accept your dictate.

As I have previously mentioned and you have ignored because it does not meet your fixed view, members of the Muslim/Pakistani/ Asian community raised concerns about the stories of abuse from within their community. It was specifically in the Jay Report but of course that will be dismissed with a wave of your hand because it does not agree with you.

Perhaps you could write an alternative report. You might be able to stretch it out to five sentences

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ColinL
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Re: BBC

Postby ColinL » Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:45 pm

cbe. The circular you posted does not constitute an 'instruction' . It did not bind, police as I have previously commented and you have ignored because it does not fit your narrative. Furthermore despite your hinting, it does not say that it had ministerial approval and circulars are rarely if ever one sentence long! Issues are not as simple as you make them. Will you post the full circular and the newspaper article on which the sentence is based.

All that readers want is a little more in the way of evidence.

cbe
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Re: BBC

Postby cbe » Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:05 pm

and yet throughout these posts you have been unable to talk about Muslims in gangs raping children without 'whataboutery' - why is that Richard?

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Richard
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Re: BBC

Postby Richard » Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:34 pm

cbe,
Because Muslims in gangs raping children is a crime just like any other raping of children is a crime. The Law doesn't typically differentiate this depending on 'the why or wherefore' of who commits a crime - as far as I am aware.
The 'whataboutery' is something you have introduced aimed at Pakistani Muslims, as a quiz on 'whatabout' if they are Muslim gangs.

cbe
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Re: BBC

Postby cbe » Thu Jan 16, 2020 7:44 am

whataboutery - Colin suggests is another 'far-right' comment (what nightmares he must have).
'Whataboutery' is where someone, unable to defend a position, widens it to - 'yes, but what about....'

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Richard
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Re: BBC

Postby Richard » Thu Jan 16, 2020 10:10 am

Annoying as it may seem, the Law cannot distinguish a category of crime based on religion or ethnic origin of the perpetrators or some other characteristic, such as skinheads from a township in Leeds.
It can only be used to act on whether an offence such as CSE or rape has occurred.
To look at the bigger picture, there may well be broader issues but an offence is still an offence and the Law does not allow for any cultural, racial or other circumstances to cloud the picture.
How could it? Unless mitigating circumstances are argued and allowed to affect the sentencing.
If there is a legal category of crime called Terrorist extremist religious fundamentalism, and the Pakistani gangs were prosecuted under that 'rule' then perhaps the attackers could be sentenced along different lines.
However, even then country of origin, culture or religious belief system would make no difference to the sentencing.
Hence it is futile to bang on about Pakistani's from a certain village.
Finally Pakistani men (and some other Muslims) are often labelled as having a bad attitude toward women but you can't change that culture or mindset just by pinpointing it, partly because not everyone will group rape and abuse/exploit women in general.

cbe
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Re: BBC

Postby cbe » Thu Jan 16, 2020 10:29 am

But the law DOES differentiate - witness the 'blind eyes' for decades - but only to
one particular section

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Richard
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Re: BBC

Postby Richard » Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:55 pm

The known issue of Pakistani CSE has been known about for many years. Police, social services, and local authority Councillors were all fully aware of what was happening, and neither Tory nor Labour governments have done much about it.
The Labour MP who spoke up for the victims (Sarah Campion of Rotherham) got crucified and then demoted.
Imagine the massive outrage and street protests had gangs of 'whites' spent the last 20 years systematically targeting, grooming and repeatedly raping hundreds of thousands of underage working class Muslim girls across UK cities, with the authorities accused of ignoring or even hiding their involvement in the most massive and shockingly racist child abuse scandal in UK history. The country would be permanently shamed globally and we’d never hear the end of it.

Does that work for you, cbe?

cbe
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Re: BBC

Postby cbe » Thu Jan 16, 2020 7:22 pm

That works exactly for me because it is the truth and you know it - you have got that so right
that it is clear that your tongue was NOT in your cheek despite how you phrase your question at the end.
Anyway Richard - we have done this to death and neither has moved so we had better leave it ,but I won't leave the thread without thanking you. I have wondered for so long how these gangs got away with it (I know why the press and politicians wouldn't touch the matter) but your thoughts throughout this matter have answered my question for me.


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