Bohemia Road House Re-numbering

[Chris Page]

Does anyone know how the houses in Bohemia Road were renumbered, according to a previous posting on here, in 1903, please?

I am trying to identify the present day property where my paternal grandmother Lucy Ellen GOLLOP's family lived at 14 Shornden Terrace on 4 June 1892 when her younger sister Emily GOLLOP was born there. According to the 1891 and 1901 censuses, there were only nine houses in Shornden Terrace numbered 7 to 15.

My research suggests Shornden Terrace was the present day terrace of houses located on the west side of Bohemia Road between the junctions with London Road and North Road to the south. I have also found that 12 Shornden Terrace was 22 Bohemia Road in the 1890s and 10 Shornden Terrace was 26 Bohemia Road in 1897. However, the present day even numbers in Bohemia Road are on the other (east) side of the road.

I found this c1905 picture of 'Shornden, Bohemia Road, Hastings' that seems to contadict that Shornden Terrace was on the west side of Bohemia Road, because it appears to be a view of the houses on the east side of Bohmia Road looking north towards the junction with London Road.

The second picture shows, what I think, is the equivalent area today on Google Maps, where it can be seen that the houses on the east side of Bohemia Road are detached, whereas those on the West side of the road are in a terrace.

Needless to say, I am rather confused and would appreciate any help and/or advice as to where Shornden Terrace was located, and which present day house was number 14, please.

[Richard]

Hello Chris,

It could be that the Terrace in question was renumbered (absorbed into) London Road?
I note that there was also a Shornden Villas, Passage and Place, plus reservoir.
Was Shornden Terrace the area between St. Matthew Church and the Clarence?
In which case the terrace was to the east side as shown on google maps.

Anyway, here is a better resolution image of the street you believe is relevant:

[Richard]

The typical form of numbering pattern would originally have been based from the centre of town outwards, with odd numbers on the left-hand side.
The following extract gives some idea of the fun and games the council got up to in renaming and renumbering roads:

http://wiki.historymap.info/1903_Roads_ ... enumbering

[whiffler]

Very convoluted history, it seems.

All images show the north-east side, which have had odd numbers on maps since 1950s.

On the west side, a large curved house used to sit at the junction with London Rd (now part of the junction), and there were two bunches of 4 houses in the 1870s, these are now 18-24 and 38-44. I can see no signs of old numbering or block naming often found on glass or brickwork.

By 1899 three more houses had been built nw near the 'round house', and others to fill the gap between the original 2 groups.

The 1956 map has no 2 being the large round house, then a gap that was never built on, then Nos 12-44 (adj North Rd) - so it now starts with no 12.


Now - here's something a little counter-intuitive for you.

Assume Shornden Terrace was numbered from 1 to 12 (and beyond) in the opposite direction to now. Renumbering would result in

1=44
2=42
3=40
4=38
5=36
6=34
7=32
8=30
9=28
10=26
11=24
12=22

I learned from a chap whose interest is in Stamp matters that the Post Office influenced the numbering of houses, normally 1 was nearest the sorting office - easier concept for the postie to grasp. Informal numbering might get caught up when there were too many 'places/villas/terraces' and the road plus number would be a simpler.

A big guess, but it fits. Dunno how to reconcile those with the 1903 renumberings, unless the proposals were known and both were in use. Also such an odd group of numbers in the census.

A riddle, wrapped in a mystery, wrapped in an enigma


Edit - a local estate agent may have info from deeds seen over the years.

[Fjh78]

Hi Chris.

Do you know anything else about the property, from family stories handed down? Any other clues at all apart from the postal address?

Felicity

[Chris Page]

Thanks to Richard for the higher resolution version of my Shornden picture and thanks to Whiffler for his renumbering suggestion (which could be right in view of 10 and 12 Shornden Terrace being 26 and 22 Bohemia Road). Thanks also to Felicity and I am afraid I don't know any more about the house from the family. In fact, until I started researching my paternal grandmother's GOLLOP family, we didn't even know they had lived in Hastings!

Below is some more information I have uncovered in the last couple of days that those of you with more experience and local knowledge than me, may be able to make more sense of.

The following is a National Archive search that shows 10 Shornden Terrace was also known as 26 Bohemia Road on 19 October 1897, and the Historical Hastings website, under the heading Shornden Terrace, says, "This, now lost, terrace, now part of London Road is believed to have extended between St Matthews Church and the Clarence (Silverhill) around 1871...". So, I am still utterly confused!

Google Maps show The Clarence on the east side of London Road just north of Beaufort Road, and this picture, from the Rye's Own Magazine website at <https://ryesown.co.uk/the-clarence-hotel-silverhill/>, shows the first tram at The Clarence, probably at the junction of
London Road and Beaufort Road which at that time actually joined London Road unlike today where it stops short of it.

This old map (OS Six inch 1888-1913) shows 'Upper Shornden Terrace' in London Road just south of Beaufort Road, where The Clarence would be, and St Matthews Church, which is consistent with the statement the terrace extended between St Matthews Church and the Clarence.

This picture is the same area from another old map (OS 25 inch 1892-1914) and although it shows St Matthews Church (centre left) and where The Clarence was located at the junction of Beaufort Road (with a 'PH'), it does not show Shornden Terrace or Upper Shornden
Terrace. It does show the tramway coming down London Road and Bohemia Road.

I have had a good look at the 1891 Census yesterday and the enumerator visited (in order) 1-22 Vale Road, Shornden Cottage, Shornden Farm Cottage, 7-15 Shornden Terrace, 2-1 Shornden Villas West, Graylands, 15-1 Shornden Villas, St Matthews Rectory, 1-4 St Matthews Road, Buckshole Cottages (2) and St Matthews School.

In the 1901 Census, an enumerator describes the contents of his district as, "Springfield Road nos 3-45, Seddlescombe Road Rosslyn to Temperance Hotel, Silverhill - Tileworth and Lodge, St Matthew's Church and Parish House, ? Cottage, St Matthew's Road no 9 (The Rectory) and 7-1, Eastern Cottage (north), Norland Rise (no 6), The Crest (no 8) and nos 12 & 14, St Matthew's Drive nos 1-15, St Matthew's Gardens nos 1-9, Venezia, The ? ?, Ivy Bank, Penchiff, Ackbrook, 2 new houses, Innis ?, Springfield Terrace West nos 1-4, St Matthews Terrace no 2-18, Shornden Terrace nos 7-15, Shornden Villas West (2), Greylands & Globe Parcels Agency, Shornden Villas nos 1-15 with house in the rear of no 14, Silverhill (east side) from Catford House to Upper Shornden Terrace with cottage in rear of Thirlmere, Upper Shornden Terrace to Beaufort Road no 1-9 & 10, Combermere Road (part of) between St Matthew's Gardens and Springfield Road.".

Examination of local newspapers at the end of the 19th century reveal lots of references to Shornden Villas and Shornden Terrace, mostly classified advertisements. Those of Shornden Villas, generally show the address as 'Shornden Villas, Silverhill', whilst those for Shornden Terrace show the address as 'Shornden Terrace, Bohemia'.

In May 1879, a property sale included, "2 Shornden terrace (south), St Leonards-on-sea", suggesting there could have been two Shornden Terraces.

In December 1871 a building encroachment case was reported and included, "The defendant is lessee or owner of the land, formerly belonging to the Eversfield Estate, abutting on the Bohemia Road. Latterly the northern portion of the land, between St Matthew's Church and the Clarence Hotel, Silverhill has been occupied by a row of houses called Shornden Terrace."

In July 1880 a report of a church meeting included, "The sermons were preached to good congregation, in a large marque, which was erected on the site of the proposed new Wesleyan Chapel, which is situate at the corner of Park Road and Shornden Terrace".

Finally, I found this 1877 map on the Historical Hastings website that shows the junction of Bohemia Road and London Road and just to the north, including Clarence Terrace South at the bottom, Clarence Villas above it, Clarence Terrace North above that and (what looks like) Margaret Terrace at the top right. I haven't been able to find if the map continues further south, but if it did it might show Shornden Terrace on it.

Thanks again for any help and/or suggestions.

[Chris Page]

Below are the two missing images from my last post. For some reason I was only able to upload three images.

[Fjh78]

Evening Chris.

I must say I found the two map uploads on your last post absolutely fascinating. I used to live at number 359 London Road so this is very much my old stomping ground . I knew the reservoir behind the house was called Shornden but had no idea there was a terrace and set of villas of that name. So im afraid I’m of no help. But I have enjoyed the little history trip your question has taken me on.

I hope you find out where your family once lived.

Felicity

[Fjh78]

I’ve just been over your information again, and compared it to the first black and white map youve uploaded, and I think, if the houses south of Beaufort Road on the east side where Upper Shornden Terrace and Villas, then the house I lived in must indeed be part of that. However, my I’m almost certain that house was Edwardian, built around 1904ish. On the opposite side of the road there is a steep bank covered in trees, at the top of which stands a detached house called Cramer House (or was). Further north is a lodge house with two gate posts and large stone eagles on top. There are no terraces of houses of that age on the west side unless you go back down to the fork in road south of St Matthews Church. I have read that London road was renumbered in 1902. My guess then, is that Upper Shornden Villas is the terrace which includes all the shops just south of the Clarence pub down to Portobello Antiques. Then it’s possibly Shornden villas, which might include the large houses detached and semi detached houses on the east side only. Then you get down to the terrace of houses in your first picture, which do have a terrace facing them on the west side, which is possibly South or Lower Shornden Terrace. I could be totally wrong here but geographically that’s got to be in the right area as all those houses back on to Upper and Lower Clarence Road, which face the Shornden Reservoir.

[Pollyanna1066]

I can't provide information about Shornden Terrace however I can tell you that the photograph in your original post is of Shornden Villas. There were 15 large villas built by Charles Clark in 1865,14 were semi-detached and one detached - they were known as 1-15 Shornden Villas or by individual names given to them later after they were sold by Charles Clark's estate in 1880 and when Bohemia Road was renumbered they became 1-29 Bohemia Road.

Shornden Terrace I guess was named after Shornden lake in the same way that the Villas were but other than that no connection as far as I know.