Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shelter

Looking for info on Hastings & St Leonards past times. Post here!
Terry
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Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:37 pm

Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shelter

Postby Terry » Sun Sep 13, 2009 4:33 am

I am also interested in finding information on the Carlisle pub. The first reference I can find is of an "Alehouse" called the Pelham Arms at No.3 Pelham Street in 1827. In an 1832 document it is described as the "Pelham Arms Public House" and has transported itself to No.5 and is about to become a coffee shop. It reappears as a pub in 1841 at No.24 Pelham Street and was rebuilt in 1892 and changes its name to the Calisle Hotel. Part of the pub was demolished when the road was widened in the 1930s and it was rebuilt again into its present form. I've been told the whole building was reinforced during WW2 so that anti aircraft guns could be installed on the roof. Does anyone know anything about this?

There was also a pub called the Denmark Arms at No.33, but I have no information about this other than that it was destroyed by a bomb in WW2.

Also, what was the origin of the ugly Public Shelter that stood next door to the Carlisle? Was this built from leftover sections from the underground car park (my guess) and when? And why was this monstrosity (my opinion) allowed to survive for so long?

I would love to see some pictures of the Carlisle before it was rebuilt in the 30s or the original Pelham Arms and the Denmark Arms before it was destroyed.






jean_b
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Re: Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shel

Postby jean_b » Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:22 pm

Hi i do remember the public shelter next to The Carlisle pub ,it was a sun lounge where you could shelter from the elements to read or just sit and watch the sea. jeanb




Terry
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Re: Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shel

Postby Terry » Tue Nov 17, 2009 8:00 am

Whoop Whoop! I managed to get hold of this old postcard dated 1924 showing the back of the pub (the side facing the sea). The postcard doesn't show who printed it so if I'm breaching anyone's copywrite its their own fault. It seems the pub was rebuilt into this form in about 1920 and unofficially renamed the Carlisle Saloon. It was built in 1825 and originally called the Pelham Arms. It was rebuilt again in the 1860s and yet again in 1892 when it was renamed Carlisle Hotel. I'd love to find out more information about this fascinating pub and see more pictures of it. It was partially demolished and rebuilt into its present form during the early 1930s.

[img://www.hastingsforum.co.uk/forums/sf_attachments/Carlisle_closeup.jpg]


Image


Terry
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Re: Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shel

Postby Terry » Tue Nov 17, 2009 8:07 am

PS: The buildings to the right were called Carlisle Villas and were demolished around 1930 when the road was widened and the building on the left of the pub collapsed in the early 60s.




david_russell
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Re: Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shel

Postby david_russell » Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:51 pm

Hi,

You can read the full history of the Carlisle in my book 'The Pubs of Hastings and St Leonards'. Your right it's a fascinating record. Where can I get a copy of the post card ?




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Geoff
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Re: Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shel

Postby Geoff » Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:05 pm

Oooh, a lovely postcard. I would like a copy too to show in the Photo Archive of this site. Is it yours Terry? Any more interesting old photos of Hastings?




Terry
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Re: Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shel

Postby Terry » Wed Dec 09, 2009 11:20 am

The picture above is an enlargement. I'll put the whole postcard up in a bit, but I'm using several computers so it may take a while due to technical stuff. As I said, the postcard does not carry the manufacturer's name, so I assume it's ok to use. I have no objection to anyone else using this image, however I am not a lawyer and don't know copywrite law. Please don't claim copywrites for it. These views should be free for everyone to see and use.




Terry
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Re: Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shel

Postby Terry » Wed Dec 09, 2009 12:27 pm

[img://www.hastingsforum.co.uk/forums/sf_attachments/4128617331_b993a2705f.jpg]


Image


Terry
Posts: 99
Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:37 pm

Re: Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shel

Postby Terry » Wed Dec 09, 2009 1:00 pm

The above is a scanned image of the postcard I purchased from a junk shop in Courthouse Street. It was the only copy they seemed to have. The remarks accompanying the photo seem to have vanished, probably due to my poor computer skill.

David: I will get around to buying a copy of your book. I've seen an illustration from it and I'm curious to know where the artist was standing. My understanding is that the Pelham Arms was built by local businessman Richard Chandler in 1825 and incorporated parts of an existing house he owned and rented to someone called Stephen Catt, who I assume was evicted. Chandler died between 1832 and 1841 and one of his seven children (also named Richard) inherited the pub. He seems to have altered the building extensively between 1859 and 1873. By 1881, the pub was in the hands of Edward Hones, but I have little information about him. In 1891 the landlord was Thomas Charles Brown, formally a professional crcketer, who rebuilt and renamed the pub in 1892, but as he seems to have remained open throughout this year and the Pelham Street side seems to remain unaltered, I doubt if the original pub was demolished, but I only have a groundplan.

I am confused about the ownership as the Observer records Francis Henry Bishop. who took over as landlord in 1913, as the owner, but the National Archives claims the pub was sold by Cobbs Brewery in 1922, but doesn't say who they sold it to. By 1930 it belonged to the Star brewery and was compulsorarily purchased by Hastings Council, who seem to have purchased it from the Star brewery again in 1952, but the Star Brewery and the Carlisle was acquired by John Courage in 1958. The Carlisle became the property of businessman Mike Ford in the 1980s, but he retired three or four years ago and the pubis now part of Bob Faulkner's empire.

Francis Bishop seems to have become a property developer in the 1930s, but remains as landlord until 1938, when he moves to the Lord Nelson. He was apparently chairman of a company called Hastings Estates and Investment Co. Ltd. who went into recievership in 1957.





Terry
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Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:37 pm

Re: Carlisle Pub (Pelham Arms), Denmark Arms and Public Shel

Postby Terry » Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:36 pm

The names Pelham Hotel and Carlisle Saloon (as in the picture and on another part of this website) pop up from time to time, but as far as I can ascertain it was officially the Pelham Arms until 1892 and the Carlisle Hotel after that, but I imagine you'd get a rather frosty reception from the landlady if you tried to book a room there today.





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